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Jean-Vic
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Joined: 27 Apr 2007
Posts: 1488
Location: Blackpool, England
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 Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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In my humble opinion, Spike fans need never worry about Spike. He's safe. Brian Lynch will never write him badly, or paint him in a bad light, and when Spike returns to DH, you can be sure Joss won't ever write him as anything but a hero. Spike is safe. No need to worry about him.
I know that's not always easy when a character is your favourite, but when it comes to this particular character, the fears are a little unfounded. For the sake of the franchise, Spike will never be used and abused. When you doubt, try and remember that. 
Now, as for another vampire with a soul...
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Double Dutchess
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Joined: 28 Apr 2009
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| Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Yeah, so far Spike has been faring much better than that other vampire (over at DH anyway). But it's like trying to convince a mum not to worry about her child... Not going to work! |
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Jean-Vic
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Joined: 27 Apr 2007
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Location: Blackpool, England
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| Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 4:31 pm Post subject: |
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Oh, I understand the fears, but there is always the thought in my head that, as Spike is the most popular character in this Universe, nothing bad will ever come of him. Maybe that's an inability on my part to suspend my disbelief far enough. 
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BrianLynch
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Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Posts: 1216
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| Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 7:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Oh yes, Spike has Spike's soul. Sit back and enjoy the ride, it's gonna be a good one. |
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itsame
Slayer
Joined: 29 Sep 2010
Posts: 81
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| Posted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 8:32 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Spike will never be used and abused. When you doubt, try and remember that. |
I'm not at all sure about that... Whedon's only happy when his characters are being used and abused!  |
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Moscow Watcher
Forum Zombie
Joined: 26 Apr 2007
Posts: 264
Location: Moscow, Russian Federation
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| Posted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:05 am Post subject: |
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| Jean-Vic wrote: | In my humble opinion, Spike fans need never worry about Spike. He's safe. Brian Lynch will never write him badly, or paint him in a bad light, and when Spike returns to DH, you can be sure Joss won't ever write him as anything but a hero. Spike is safe. No need to worry about him.
I know that's not always easy when a character is your favourite, but when it comes to this particular character, the fears are a little unfounded. For the sake of the franchise, Spike will never be used and abused. When you doubt, try and remember that. |
Jean-Vic, I hear you - but before season 8 I was thinking the same about Angel. In this season Spike got off easy only because he was a secondary player. But if he gets his own title, he'll get full Joss treatment.
On one hand, I'm looking forward to it, but, OTOH, I'm scared.
| Quote: | | Now, as for another vampire with a soul... |
Look at it this way: everything bad that had to happen to Angel in Joss hands is already happened. His future is redemption.
While everything bad that has to happen to Spike in Joss' hands hasn't even started...
(paranoid? moi?) 
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Jean-Vic
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Joined: 27 Apr 2007
Posts: 1488
Location: Blackpool, England
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| Posted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Moscow Watcher wrote: |
Jean-Vic, I hear you - but before season 8 I was thinking the same about Angel. In this season Spike got off easy only because he was a secondary player. But if he gets his own title, he'll get full Joss treatment.
On one hand, I'm looking forward to it, but, OTOH, I'm scared.
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You see, I never thought that about Angel because, for me, Angel never stopped getting used and abused and by that I mean, made to look the bad guy. He gets blamed for Connor going to hell as a baby, he gets blamed for Fred dying cos he took over W&H, he gets blamed for LA going to hell, he gets blamed for all his actions as Twilight. In my experience, Angel is always portrayed in a bad light. I mean, for the majority of Season 5 he was made to look downright awful in comparison to Spike. Look at Destiny, The writers might as well have put a list of all of Angel's faults on screen and said, "Look, here is how Spike is a better man!" Oh wait, they did that. I believe the only writer who has ever said that Spike is inferior to Angel is Brian Lynch. Now, I don't mean to say that Spike is inferior because IMO they are equals, but what I mean to say is that BL has portrayed Spike as believing HIMSELF to be less than Angel. He has seen the good Angel has done and realises that in comparison, he has done very little. Now that coming from Spike is a positive reflection on Angel which is a rare thing these days. It isn't true that Angel is better, but it was nice to see Spike thinking that way. It shows his more vulnerable side, and not the bravado he shows externally.
| Quote: |
Look at it this way: everything bad that had to happen to Angel in Joss hands is already happened. His future is redemption.
While everything bad that has to happen to Spike in Joss' hands hasn't even started...
(paranoid? moi?) |
Haha, I like your thinking but its a little off, IMO, because you see, after Angelus Angel's future was redemption, until he drank from Buffy. Then he moved to LA where his future was redemption, until he went dark. Then again, his future was redemption until he took over W&H. Then again his future was redemption until he got LA sent to hell. And then, I think, his future was redemption, until he became Twilight and started killing slayers. And now his future is redemption.... do you see the pattern? In the years Spike has had a soul, name one bad thing he has voluntarily done - 1) What he said to Robin Wood
2) Bragging about slayers he killed, in Season 5. That's it. So, Spike has had a soul for 3 seasons and in that time he has done those two things. After Angel had had his for two years (in show terms) he was trying to end the world. In historical terms, he was still killing, albeit criminals and travelling with Darla, Spike and Dru.
So for me, no, Spike will never be one who is used in a negative way. He shall always, IMO, be the quintessential hero in the Buffyverse. Why? Because a lot of fans get lairy when he isn't. Need to keep that money coming in, and if people aren't happy, people aren't buying. What makes people happy? Hero Spike.
But, that's how I see things. I'm just going off my experience and perception of the verse and the fandom.
By the way, BL, enjoying the Spike series. Excellent work as usual. No one writes Spike like you do.
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nmcil12
Comic Book Guy
Joined: 14 Aug 2010
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Sun Nov 14, 2010 10:02 am Post subject: |
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| I loved the "evolution chart" - and the text reminded me immediately of his description of Angel being as boring as a lampshade. Spike has always made some tough comments to Angel and his "hero title." This "evolution chart" also reminded me of the "designated monkey" comparisons from Spike about Angel/Angelus. |
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fender_love
I'm kind of a big deal
Joined: 09 Feb 2009
Posts: 157
Location: STO Headquarters.
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| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2010 11:15 am Post subject: |
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Does Barnes & Noble carry the new Spike series? I traveled three hours to get to a comic book shop that said that they carried it only to find that they didn't, but there's a B&N in the area so I thought I'd check there. 
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sueworld
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Joined: 08 Mar 2007
Posts: 1213
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| Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2010 1:26 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Look at Destiny, The writers might as well have put a list of all of Angel's faults on screen and said, "Look, here is how Spike is a better man!" Oh wait, they did that |
Yes, but as you well know the whole point of that set up was not to make Spike look good for the sake of it, but to make Angel doubt himself. A case of the old 'tear em' down before building them up again' kind of thing. The whole plot is there to serve Angels story, and Spike challenging him was just a part of that.
So imo not quite how you're making it seem I'm afraid.
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Ryall
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Joined: 01 Mar 2007
Posts: 894
Location: San Diego, CA
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| Posted: Sun Nov 21, 2010 5:52 pm Post subject: |
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| fender_love wrote: | | Does Barnes & Noble carry the new Spike series? I traveled three hours to get to a comic book shop that said that they carried it only to find that they didn't, but there's a B&N in the area so I thought I'd check there. |
They'll carry the book when it's been collected into TPB but they don't carry the individual issues, only comic shops have those.
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Double Dutchess
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Joined: 28 Apr 2009
Posts: 1122
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| Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 5:37 am Post subject: |
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| fender_love wrote: | | I traveled three hours to get to a comic book shop that said that they carried it only to find that they didn't |
But couldn't they order it for you? I visited my comics shop on Saturday only to find that Angel #39 was already sold out, but they immediately ordered an extra copy for me; no problem... (It will take 2 weeks before I get it, so maybe that's why this is not your preferred route. I would expect things to go quicker within the USA though.) |
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pshand05
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Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 1233
Location: NY
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| Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2010 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Double Dutchess wrote: | | But couldn't they order it for you? I visited my comics shop on Saturday only to find that Angel #39 was already sold out, but they immediately ordered an extra copy for me; no problem... (It will take 2 weeks before I get it, so maybe that's why this is not your preferred route. I would expect things to go quicker within the USA though.) |
A lot of comic shops don't do that. They want you to fill out the Previews forms. If it ain't there, won't be in the store.
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fender_love
I'm kind of a big deal
Joined: 09 Feb 2009
Posts: 157
Location: STO Headquarters.
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| Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2010 11:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Double Dutchess wrote: | | But couldn't they order it for you? |
Nope, none of the comic book shops within six hours of my town will order comics anymore unless you place an order of $50 or more. I did wind up actually getting to read the issue thanks to a friend who let me borrow her copy for the weekend, but I'll just have to wait to get my own.
After all that searching, I really didn't enjoy the issue as much as I had hoped. It was good, but maybe I had built up my expectations too much after treating it like the Holy Grail for two weeks? I did get some hilarious mental imagery of the bar in the White Suite being Lloyd's bar from The Shining... mostly with John blasting down doors with his mystical bazooka of doom and chasing Spike through a hedge-maze. Heeeeeeere's Johnny, indeed.
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Double Dutchess
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Joined: 28 Apr 2009
Posts: 1122
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| Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 2:21 am Post subject: |
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| pshand05 wrote: | | Double Dutchess wrote: | | But couldn't they order it for you? I visited my comics shop on Saturday only to find that Angel #39 was already sold out, but they immediately ordered an extra copy for me; no problem... (It will take 2 weeks before I get it, so maybe that's why this is not your preferred route. I would expect things to go quicker within the USA though.) |
A lot of comic shops don't do that. They want you to fill out the Previews forms. If it ain't there, won't be in the store. |
| fender_love wrote: |
Nope, none of the comic book shops within six hours of my town will order comics anymore unless you place an order of $50 or more. |
Oh, that's too bad. Sounds like I am really lucky with my own comics shop! I never need to order anything in advance, because they always get the Angel comics anyway, including all the off-shoots. And if an issue is sold out they simply order an extra copy for me. But maybe that kind of approach is not feasible in the USA, where I imagine people are interested in a lot more different titles. (I'm guessing that the Buffy and Angel comics are relatively popular in my country.)
| fender_love wrote: | | After all that searching, I really didn't enjoy the issue as much as I had hoped. It was good, but maybe I had built up my expectations too much after treating it like the Holy Grail for two weeks? I did get some hilarious mental imagery of the bar in the White Suite being Lloyd's bar from The Shining... mostly with John blasting down doors with his mystical bazooka of doom and chasing Spike through a hedge-maze. Heeeeeeere's Johnny, indeed. |
I had the same experience: I enjoyed the issue, but it didn't entirely live up to my -- admittedly high -- expectations. I was shocked to find that I actually liked Illyria #1 better! It had an emotional depth that I missed in the Spike comic. But I'm confident we will be getting that later on in the Spike series too.
And I can totally see John doing "The Shining". He does have that scary psychotic vibe, and his name totally fits. So now you've planted that mental imagery firmly in my head too! |
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