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[Mamu_Nestor]

[shanecdavis]

I usually get caught up in things and have to read the last two issues over the weekend, but I couldn't wait to read through #14! As I said before, this was the second issue I was able to pick up when it came out, and first of many from the new "Sev", although I would miss out for a few more months until Delores (insert Seinfeld joke here), figured out what we were doing and made sure to tell us when she was getting them. I don't really remember why we missed issues through the summer. We were there almost daily. I can only guess that since I got #11 on a Saturday that in my mind I must have come to the conclusion that was when the comics came out. I would think I would have checked other days though too. Or at least asked her about them. Oh well.

The cover was all kinds of awesome! Destro leading COBRA forces in an ambush against the Joes. Then I turned to the first page. WTF?? Snake Eyes was in a bunker with some big eskimo named Kwinn and the "evil Dr. Venom"??? I only have a few memories from that first read, but that was one I'll never forget. Snake Eyes wasn't a big deal to me then, as I thought his uniform was pretty goofy, so I didn't really get into these scenes as much as I would later. Reading the first few panels I could see I missed out on quite a bit. It was still weird to see Hawk as the leader of the team. From the figures I had collected, Stalker really stood out from the others and just looked like the leader. I had no idea what the paygrades meant back then and Hawk was just some regular soldier that came with the MMS to me.

So it seemed that Baroness and Destro shared a deeper past than she let on in #11. Does anyone remember if the Destro action figure was released before this issue came out? Would have been cool if it wasn't. Can't remember for the life of me. It was cool to see the inner workings of the COBRA base. I believe to this point we have only seen CC's shooting range and a comm room. This issue shows us a few areas just underneath the surface of the town it seems. Many dark areas where a secret conversation or two could take place. I enjoyed seeing the Joe base for the first time too. First, Clutch driving some Gen. Flagg to a Motor Pool and then the eleveator taking them down. So cool. It's funny because at that time my grandma lived in a town south of us that was really called Springville, but I always called it Springfield thinking that is what my parents always said. This was another vivd memory of mine from my first read, seeing the name Springfield displayed on a map. I thought it was soooo cool. Well I did, until I paid attention one time we drove to visit her and I saw the 'Springville' sign. Bummer. On a related note, just want to point out that our very own Robert Atkins actually does live in a city called Springfield. Can't remember which state, but that has to be pretty cool.

This is where things became confusing for me. The microdot the Joes recovered was supposed to show the location of the COBRA base to be in Fort Wadsworth, which is actually the base of the Joes. Instead, Scar-Face switched the document with one where the microdot showed the location to be a town called Springfield. I would later learn that the COBRA base was in Springfield. Took me a while back then to realize that the Springfield in Vermont was not the same as the Springfield where COBRAs base is located. Interesting that CC would use other towns with the same name for his operations. Crazy used car salesman!

Can't believe how much action and suspense is packed into this issue! The Joes mobilizing. Snake Eyes, Venom, and Kwinn trying to escape the bunker without killing each other first. CC and Baroness heading to Sprinfield to oversee the toxin experiment. Destro taking a team there to try to head off the Joes. Still not particularly liking Vosburg's art, but I must agree with Torpedo that he does handle action scenes pretty damn well. I liked how we were let in on how far away both Destro and the Joes were. Destro was five miles east on foot and the Joes were two miles west in the APc. Sure it was five miles since they had to take the roads, but it still showed the urgency of Destro to get there in time.

Personally, I enjoyed the way Mr. Hama would switch scenes between panels. One page had all four scenes on it. That just added to the intensity of the story. I must credit Vosburg on one particular page. It's during the countdown of the COBRA plane to launch. The first panel was okay, but the second one depicting the Joe's engaging Destro's forces in front of the funiture factory was gripping. The next panel with Destro standing and firing with rounds impacting around him was one of a few times where he drew Destro well. The final panel though, depicting the Skystriker swooping down to get into position was just awesome.

Reading through this issue again I can't help be be amazed at what a great story it was! Just an entertaining read from the first to last page. My biggest issue with this story has always been the art. If only Springer would have come aboard a year earlier! Of course, I had issues with Springer too, but only after some artist named Rod Whigham would take over for an issue and blow my mind, setting the standard for what I would forever judge future Joe artists against.

On to #15!!

[Mamu_Nestor]

As a kid Springfield had another conotation for me. It was the town ext to the one I grew up in Northern Virgina. I would have gone to there high school had we stayed there. I always thought that Springfield Virgina would be a great stagi g ground for Cobra, being only a few minutes from Washington DC
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Author: Karate is Self-Defense Available at Amazon.com. Kindle Version Coming Soon.

[shanecdavis]

Wow, yeah that would have. Did we ever figure out exactly which state COBRA's Springfield was in?

BTW - How dumb was it on the last page to see the solicit - "Kwinn gets even in..."?!! SPOILER ALERT!!!!

[Torpedo]

"Force Recon's the way to go!"

I've said it before, but a great thing about re-reading these classic stories in order is remembering and realizing how nearly every issue after #10 introduced a new character or vehicle from the action figure line into the world Larry Hama was building. Issue #14, "Destro Attacks", gives us our very first look at the metal-masked face of the man known as Destro, but it also introduces Ace, the Sky Striker and the APC.

I've already talked about how much I loved the Snake Eyes/Dr. Venom/Kwinn story arc in these issues. It's no different in issue #14 where we find the three of them trapped, reliant on each other but still ready to kill each other at a moment's notice. I'll delve further into this triangle next issue, but for issue #14 I'll just say that whenever I see Kwinn's thought bubbles as he opens the bunker door--"Spirit of the Otter, help me dive deep. Spirit of the Bear, give me strength to open this door. And Spirit of the Weasel, give me counsel to outwit this Dr. Venom."--I always hear the theme song to the '80s cartoon BraveStarr in my head.

Repeating myself again, I know, but part of the reason the second wave 1983 characters are my favorites is because of the added diversity of functions and branches. I understand the rationale of making G.I. Joe a special missions unit of the U.S. Army, but I think if this group had been created today--unless it was all Rangers--it would have had a lot more representatives of the Navy and USMC. (Hell, I think Breaker could've been an Air Force Combat Controller and Ripcord should've been a ParaRescue Trooper.) Anyway, it was great to see Torpedo representing the Navy and Gung Ho the Marines. Issue #14 gave us G.I. Joe's first Air Force fighter pilot, Ace. His role isn't exactly essential to this issue, and Hawk could have called in an air strike from any anonymous air group, but it was great seeing Ace and the Sky Striker get some page time.

Did anybody catch the strange sort-of-continuity gaffe in this issue? When the Baroness and Destro are talking just before his face is revealed for the first time, their dialogue suggests that "Destro" is the code name he has taken for his new life as an agent of Cobra. Baroness asks, "Must I call you by that awful name?" Destro says, "Say my name. My new name." Boy, this kind of rings unnatural if his name is James McCullen Destro...

Anyway, the last thing I'll say about this issue is what others have touched on regarding the enigmatic Springfield. I grew up in Illinois, the capital of which is Springfield, and I always kind of thought it might have been the haven for Cobra. Never would have guessed as a lad that I'd end up moving to Vermont where another Springfield played host to a Cobra chemical weapons test in this issue. I can tell you, though, that x number of miles as the crow flies is cruelly deceptive compared to how long it takes driving on actual Vermont roads. (Stupid mountains and lack of east-west interstate highways!)


Oh, by the way, shane, Gung Ho got some more love this issue being part of the scouting team with Stalker.

Say, wait a minute. Didn't Doc say Stalker would need a couple weeks recuperating in the base hospital at the end of #13? How long have Snake Eyes and the others been trapped under water?
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Author of Mr. Smartass, available for Amazon's Kindle, iPad/iPhone, and other e-reader devices and apps.

[Mamu_Nestor]

[Torpedo]

[jackharkness]

D'OH!!!!!!!!!!!

[Torpedo]

"You are a good pilot, Venom. Too bad the Weasel spirit lives in your belly like a cancer. I might have to carve it out for you someday."

Man, did Larry Hama give Kwinn all the greatest lines, or what?

The running subplot of Snake Eyes, Kwinn and Dr. Venom which began in issue #12 takes center stage in #15, "Red-Eye to Miami". It was a masterful bit of storytelling by throwing these three foils into a locked room with each other and watching how many ways they can each try to get the upper hand on the other(s). The locked room expands from flooding bunker to the jungles of Sierra Gordo, to the airfield at Rio Lindo, to the cockpit of the Lancaster prop they use to escape. The simple genius of making Dr. Venom the only one capable of flying them to safety creates so many dramatic reversals and important moments. Snake Eyes and Kwinn each face a moment when they're going to kill Venom, only to have the other remind them how indispensable the doctor is to their survival. "A man who whips a dog," Kwinn reminds us, "will pull his own sled someday."

From a pure structural level, Larry deftly builds ands builds on the tension by throwing more danger at the trio, from the propellor that won't turn over, to the third spitfire chasing them, to Venom's treasonous attempt to dump Snake Eyes and Kwinn out the bombay doors, to the out-of-nowhere encounter with a smuggling ship that severs their fuel lines. The rising action and the stalemated conflict between Kwinn and Venom puts them on an inescapable path to death, what Shakespeare called the "Obligatory Scene". Kwinn and Venom have to face each other when this is all over, and at least one of them won't survive. It's just a matter of whom, and when. Of course, Larry wasn't done having his fun with these two; he'd make the reader wait four more issues before we get the climax to this plot.

Even though these three are the focus of issue #15, they're not the only characters. It should be noted that other members of the G.I. Joe team get an entire two panels in this issue. (And yet, it'd be another 120 issues before the series was renamed SNAKE EYES and His Ninja Friends and Sometimes G.I. Joe.) It's also worth mentioning that issue #15 introduces, more or less as an afterthought, Major Bludd.

Cobra Commander suspects Destro of betrayal and brings Major Bludd in to take care of that situation. This minor bit of information will end up having serious ramifications in the next few issues and even longer than that for some characters. And on top of that, the Cobra hierarchy keep dropping Scar-Face's name as a scapegoat for whatever sinister back-stabbing they have in mind. What did this maligned Cobra Officer do to become so important? And what did he do to piss so many dangerous people off?
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Author of Mr. Smartass, available for Amazon's Kindle, iPad/iPhone, and other e-reader devices and apps.

[Torpedo]

We're halfway through the soap-opera saga that spanned issues #12-19. We've reread some incredible moments, and there are more still to come! This was such a good idea to revisit these issues together at the same time. Thanks for the idea, ER. Thanks for coordinating it, shane. And thanks to everyone else who is participating in the trip down Nostalgia Lane.


My ranking for this weeks issues:

1. #11 - Incredible: one of my Top 5 issues, and one of my favorite covers!
2. #13 - Excellent
3. #12 - Excellent
4. #15 - Excellent
5. #14 - Excellent
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Author of Mr. Smartass, available for Amazon's Kindle, iPad/iPhone, and other e-reader devices and apps.

[ER]

Read #12-15 over the weekend! Seriously, some of the best issues ever

As a kid, the first one I read [EDIT: first one that I read out of #12-15] was #14 - my cousin had it and he showed it to me when he learned that I had begun collecting Joe comics, but that was the only issue he had. At that point it was sometime in '87 and I had the current 1987 issues as well as a good chunk of the 1986 stories - they were easy to get as back-issues, but I don't think I had anything prior to #49 "Serpentor" at that time. When I first opened the page and saw Snake-Eyes trapped in the bunker with two characters I didn't recognize, with the water pouring in, it just blew me away - what a great suspenseful first page - even though I had no idea what was going on I was sucked right into the story immediately! After reading a little I was excited to see that the crazy-lab coat guy was Dr. Venom - I had read his name in #49 and had always been wondering who he was.

Reading #14 did confuse me at first. In the issues I had so far, Destro was always talking about honor and not wanting to betray Cobra Commander, but then here he was in #14 trying to set up CC to be captured. And the Joes attacking Springfield confused me too since I knew that they discovered and attacked it in #49-50. Of course I eventually figured out that there was more than one Springfield, but at the time it was confusing, even though I absolutely loved the issue.

Fortunately it wasn't too long after that I got the #12-14 digest issue, and reading that for the first time still stands out as one of the best Joe reading experiences that I've ever had. Reading #12 and #13 for the first time combined with seeing #14 in context with these previous issues was just an amazing read! And then I picked up the #15-17 digest issue when it came out and that was my first time reading #15.

I just love the fun adventure/serial feel to these and after all these years they still stand the test of time. #12-19 is probably my all time favorite arc.

Here's my rankings for week 3: (and they're all amazing, so I really have to split hairs to try to come up with an order)

Excellent
#12
#15
#13
#14
#11

Hate to disagree with you Torpedo, but #11, as amazing as it is, for me, just doesn't quite stand up to the SE/Venom/Kwinn stuff and the switched microdot drama and the virus/serum plot, etc. that's all thru #12-15. But yeah, #11 is still incredible, so I certainly can't fault you for placing it in first

I absolutely love all five of these covers as well - if I had to choose a favorite, I'd probably go with #14

Another thing that struck me while reading these issues is how meaty they are - the amount of panels per page on some of these really gives a reader their dollar's worth.

#16, here I come!
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[shanecdavis]

Wow, I totally forgot to add my thoughts on #15. What a great issue this was! The big glaring error though is at the end of #14 we see the COBRAs leading Snake Eyes and Venom away from the river, but when #15 opens they are back to the river and go through similar dialogue we got back in #14. Personally, I fudged this by having the events in #14 actually happen in Kwinn's head after the "good doctor" whacked him with the wrench. That was a dream sequence that the big eskimo used in order to will himself awake. The beginning of #15 are the actual events as they unfolded.

The rest of the story really keeps you enthralled as the trio has to deal with constant problems, but trying to keep an eye on each other. As Torpedo stated, this really was a great dynamic having Kwinn, Venom, and Snake Eyes paired up like this. Paired? Anyway, at this point Venom has tried to kill both Kwinn and Snake Eyes while both Kwinn and Snake Eyes had to stop the other from killing Venom. I do wish I would have been able to enjoy these issues when they came out. My next issue after #14 was #18, and then I wouldn't get another one until #24. It wasn't until that summer that I FINALLY was able to pick it up every month.

Another faux pas in this issue is when Kwinn and Snake Eyes were dumping things out of the Lanc. We clearly see Kwinn's .30 cal get tossed. Somehow though, one of the coppers mentions that "the big lunk was carrying a .30 caliber air-cooled, for Pete's sake!" as if he had it in his possession. I ended up fudging this by having the copper actually watching the news, which was reporting the Coast Guard had recovered the items after observing the plane unloading them. Kinda works I guess.

Overall, this was a great week's worth of reading! The first multi-issue storyline and still one of the best. Here is my ranking:

1. Marvel #11
2. Marvel #14
3. Marvel #12
4. Marvel #13
5. Marvel #15

Time to catch up with Week #4!

[Torpedo]

I always figured Kwinn had an endless supply of .30 caliber machine guns he pulled out some kind of magic portal in his pocket.
_________________
Author of Mr. Smartass, available for Amazon's Kindle, iPad/iPhone, and other e-reader devices and apps.

[ER]

Shane and Torpedo, I actually just posted on the week 4 thread an editor response to Kwinn's gun from the letter page in #18

As for the discrepancy between the end of #14 and the beginning of #15 maybe the end of #14 was actually the Bear Spirit giving Kwinn a vision of the future if he didn't intervene and change it! (And if Larry knew back in '83 that people would be having this conversation in 2012 it probably would have scared him )
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www.hamaverse.weebly.com

[cmajor]